Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign welcome to Life and Limb, a podcast from Thrive magazine all about living well with limb loss or limb difference. I'm Jeff Thiessen, publisher of Thrive magazine and your podcast host.
My guest this episode is Tracy McChartz, who was a prominent figure in Ontario's political circles and now the same in amputee circles with the volunteer work that she does for a number of organizations.
Tracy was the former Ontario minister of accessibility, but never planned to be a politician until she saw a newspaper article announcing that the retirement of a then current mpp.
And so with no experience, her political journey began.
And Tracy never planned to be an amputee either, despite being just hours away from amputation of her left leg as a teenager with cancer, a last minute life saving surgery averted that. She did however, become an above knee amputee just before her 60th birthday.
And Tracy knows disability well professionally and personally as her now late husband Stephen Little was a wheelchair user and a prominent figure in the disability community.
But she didn't know about living with an amputation. And so her limb loss journey began. Tracy, welcome. How are you doing?
[00:01:27] Speaker B: I'm very well, thank you Jeff, good to see you and hear you.
[00:01:30] Speaker A: Good to see you too. And hear you too.
I want to talk about how you navigated your limb loss journey now three years in, but let's start with that avoidance, that avoiding amputation many years ago as a teenager, but essentially living most of your life with an internal prosthetic device. Let's, let's talk about that first.
[00:01:53] Speaker B: Sure. So that's true. I was scheduled for an amputation and avoided that the very last minute. Was able to go to the United States and have limb salvage surgery. And I went on to have several limb salvage surgeries over the decades. And I kind of put the whole idea of being an amputee in the rear view mirror. It, you know, I went on with my life. I was just a reasonably selfish teenager that wanted to hang out with my friends, get off to university, fit in, blend in, not stand out.
I did have all my chemotherapy in Canada, but I just kept going. And I don't know what motivated me to just keep going, but I really forgot about amputation for the longest time and my journey was one of limb salvage for many years and I had lots of long periods of time where the internal prosthesis that I had put in in Philadelphia served me very well. And I didn't start developing complications until after my first election as a provincial politician. So it was 2011 when I had complications which was also after a second diagnosis of cancer. I had breast cancer in my 40s as a fairly young mom.
And, and that was kind of the beginning of lots of years of complications. There was a couple good years here and there, but never, never really thought about amputation again. It was still on that limb salvage journey right up until three years ago.
[00:03:34] Speaker A: Was it complications with the internal prosthetic
[00:03:37] Speaker B: device that, well, the first, the first one that I had done in the United States, it just broke in two, probably just from wear and tear and campaigning in my first election.
And what was replaced here in Canada was good, but I was older now. It was not 1980 when I was first diagnosed and had my first limb salvage surgery. I was older and it was newer technology, which is great, but my, my strength, my muscular strength, skin, you know, had changed a lot and it served me okay. What was replaced in 2011, that was when I had replacement in Canada.
But then, you know, complications develop, internal infections and dislocations and kind of sort of minor fix, minor surgical fixes. And then I had a whole rebuild again. And as recently as 2022, just taking everything out, trying to start all over again. But the complications persisted.
And it just got to the point where my surgeon said it's time to talk about quality of life and, and surviving, surviving these complications. So the amputation happened three years ago, which, you know, was the right decision, but really I don't think I was thinking about amputation up until that, that point. Just three years ago.
[00:05:17] Speaker A: Yeah.
So then you have the, the amputation and of course that's becomes a massive focus of yours in, in your first year for, for sure.
And I'm wondering, like, how do you measure progress now? I, I, I, your life as a politician, I'm sure it was always metric and you know, tools of, of measurement. And I, I love how you talk about life goes on you a motto or a mantra of yours. You mention it a lot when, when we chat. So let, let's, let's dig into that. What exactly does that mean life goes on to you?
[00:05:57] Speaker B: Well, I think, Jeff, after, you know, the amputation, I went into a mode a lot of new amputees go into, which is hyper fixation on what do I need to do, what do I need to learn? Becomes almost like a job.
Who's my prosthetist? What about pt?
How am I going to navigate this? Do I need an ot? What about my home? Even though I was married to someone in a wheelchair and our home is reasonably accessible, but that was for a wheelchair user, not an amputee. And I was also concurrently my husband's caregiver before my amputation, and that continued after my amputation. There were times he was my caregiver, but we were approaching some very difficult years with my husband, Steven. So I was, like I said, hyper fixated on what do I need to do because I was a, you know, problem solver. I think I still am a problem solver. And in public life, it's all about solving problems, just connecting with people, trying to get answers and trying to move forward, find common ground to things. And as an amputee, I didn't know where to turn for support and I didn't know what I needed to do. I even, even bought stuff for my house that I thought would make my life easier. And I, I wasn't making the right moves. I wasn't talking to other amputees very much. I did get some peer support from the amputee coalition, but. But I thought the more I did to try to, I don't know, fix things, the better life would be for me as an amputee. And I really was out of my league in terms of what I needed to focus on in the short term and then in a longer term.
So then it becomes a bit frustrating because the progress isn't what you think it's going to be.
It's easy to look at the ads for prosthetic devices and say, wow, I'm going to jump those streams and rocks in no time. If I get that kind of prosthetic leg, it's going to be great.
But I had to remind myself that I'm in my early 60s now and I have other health issues, including a pretty carved up sound leg.
And I need to measure my success differently than if I had had that amputation at age 17 or even in my 30s or 40s or 50s.
So the frustration sort of came up because I couldn't solve the problems like I, I was used to solving problems in my personal and professional life. And so I had to, you know, accept that and as I say, measure my success differently. And, and it took me a long time to recognize I can't just 100% be focused on healing and recovering from this amputation. I got to look after the rest of my life, my family, my mental health, all those things. But in those early days, amputation, it's just like, what do I got to do?
I'm not saying I thought I'd grow my leg back, but it was kind of that behavior and it really, it was frustrating because I Couldn't fix it. And I didn't know how to move forward exactly until I got more time experience under my belt and connected with more amps.
[00:09:29] Speaker A: So the life goes on model, building on what you just talked about, is that, is that motivational for you or is that giving yourself permission to pause and find solutions?
How does that guide you?
[00:09:44] Speaker B: Well, the life goes on concept that I've been thinking a lot. I mean, part of that comes with aging. You know, I'm blessed to be able to live this long and achieve, you know, many of my goals. Not all of them, but many of them. And life goes on for me just like it does for everyone else. I've experienced loss. I lost my husband last year.
Some exciting and joyous things like the marriage of my son just last month.
Experiencing some new things in my life like travel and maybe trying some things I wouldn't have tried before I was an amp. Our, my husband's and my life was very consumed with, you know, a lot of medical situations, a lot of surgery. So that was kind of the focus. But I think after amputation, I'm more aware that life is going on for me, for my friends, my family. And some of those things are great and some are challenging and being an amputee is just, you know, part of that. And some of the things that happen in life have very little to do with being an amputee.
And as I said, those early days, it was hard not to just focus on how to be a good new amputee, but also managing expectations. Right. Because you think, oh, if I do this and that, I'll be walking and getting on running blades, whatever. Right.
And I think the passage of time is very healing and helpful because as I said, life goes on for me and for, for others all around me. And I'm learning to notice that and to keep in mind, even though I still have lots of medical needs and lots of specialists, I need to see that it doesn't have to define me completely.
[00:11:43] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a great answer. And I love the way you talked about the celebration of life, your son's marriage, new daughter in law, no doubt.
[00:11:52] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:11:53] Speaker A: Wonderful travel. I mean, that, that can be a very fear inducing concept for, for new amputees. And I know that was a victory for you, right?
[00:12:05] Speaker B: Huge victory. And I, I've always enjoyed pushing myself and you know, I like challenges and there's nothing more challenging than when someone says you shouldn't do something, then I'm quite interested in trying it. But the travel piece was more the reality of my life and my family's life in recent years. You know, when the kids were younger, we were able to, you know, do some basic travel like go to Disney and visit some family United States, but we had never done much more.
Now at this point, after my amputation, I, you know, I've been able to travel in Canada and the United States, and I plan to go to Europe. I've never been to Europe.
I love that my husband, who was a former Paralympian and world traveler, got to see a lot of the world.
That was before we got married and started our own family.
And I'm so happy he got to experience that. Unfortunately, I never got to experience the world outside of North America. So that's one of my goals now. And yes, it will be challenging. We're working with one of your other contacts. I think you may have had her on a podcast. And I know she's been in Thrive magazine.
Tanya from Right Foot Adventures, who specializes in accessibility travel. So working with her is making this. This planning a lot easier, for sure, and a little less scary.
[00:13:43] Speaker A: Yeah, I'll bet. And like you, she's above the amputee as well, so. That's right kindredship there.
[00:13:50] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:13:52] Speaker A: And, I mean, that leans into my next question about independence and, and certainly that brings some of that independence. You've always been you. Fiercely, I would say pursued throughout your life. But you've also said that you've never been really good at accepting help. And, and life is different for you now. And I mean for me, too. As a double arm amputee, I still benefit from some help once in a while. Makes life a little bit more convenient. So how are you.
How are you handling that? The asking for help or the receiving it? Are you better at it now?
[00:14:29] Speaker B: I'm. I'm getting better. It's the work in progress. And you're right, I. I've always prided myself on being fiercely independent. And again, with my former internal prosthesis in my leg, it was the smoke and mirrors thing. I didn't look disabled, even though I was very disabled in many ways. So it was a bit of a, as I say, smoke and mirrors thing. And as a politician, it's sort of a core competency that you, you know, can be independent and that you have strong leadership skills and all that kind of stuff.
So being an amp and just getting older, I am learning to embrace accepting help and not interpreting it as a weakness, that everybody actually needs help and everybody has something different to offer to help you. So I very much Appreciate, you know, my connections with friends and family, neighbors, former colleagues, and recognizing that it's okay to ask for help and they may be better at stuff than I am. At the same time, I feel I'm honing my skills to offer my help to people. I've always been very interested in helping people in public service. My husband and I did a lot of community work and volunteer work, but helping on a more practical level, I guess just whatever my friends and family, neighbors need. And I'm not saying it has to be even the help I ask for and the help I give, but, but that's part of it is being helpful. A practical example is being able to drive a friend to the train station.
You know, I can drive and it's complicated for her. She's not an amputee. But, you know, trying to do things like that and then helping myself, that would be the third part of helping, is recognizing how I can help myself, how I can push myself. I am, even though I'm very goal oriented, I tend to be cautious and safe, which is a good thing as an amputee. But I'm also looking at how I can help myself achieve, you know, some other goals that they want in life and, and, and push forward to, to try new things, do things differently, you know, in a safe way. And, and as I said, I'm very appreciative of people that help me, but I also need to figure out how to help myself too.
[00:17:08] Speaker A: Yeah, and you and I have talked about this a little bit with aging. I mean, self care becomes a little bit more of a priority than in decades past. And I think that's part of the package for you too, right? A holistic self care.
[00:17:23] Speaker B: Right. And it's easy to, you know, lose yourself a bit, you know, at any, under any circumstances of your life. But you know, as an amputee, right. You can get, as I said, very hyper focused on what you're doing or not doing as an amputee. And, and a lot of my volunteer these days, volunteer work these days is on helping other amputees, whether it's as a certified peer visitor with the coalition and on their board of directors and leading some of their strategy work and trying to make paus positive changes for amps. There's, there's a lot of challenges out there, and I love a challenge, but it also can be very consuming. Right. So for example, this whole agenda to get better access for prosthetic care and better funding, some days it feels like a massive mountain to climb.
And across our nation there's such variability in terms of how amputees are supported financially and it, it's, it's, it's tricky because it's different depending on where you live, whether you have insurance and whether you have support from charities, things like that. So I love helping other amps. I love helping change policy as I did when I was a politician and shaping public policy. But I'm also needing to put kind of guardrails around that too to make sure I'm, I'm focusing on all my goals in life, not just as an amputee or volunteer, but what other things do I want to do in my life and trying to find that balance.
I find, you know, not working on full time on one job is actually a little more complicated because you get pulled into a lot of different things. Before it was like, no, I just have no time. I'm busy in this other role 9 to 5. But there's a lot of interesting things to do out there and a lot of them are really important.
But I think now that I'm sort of settling into my role as an amputee and I'm been exploring, you know, different ways to volunteer and help my community and do some other things like part time teaching and things like that at the university.
I gotta really think about this next phase around how I want to spend my time and who I want to spend it with, you know, who are the family and friends that I'm closest to, where our values align and you know, hopefully have some fun along the way too. That can't all be serious, can't all be work.
[00:20:09] Speaker A: Sure. I do want to talk to you a little bit more about the organizations that you're involved with and the commitments you've made to the amputee community and, and the practitioner side of it as well. But you had mentioned challenges and you have told me that you are a great warrior.
So I know that one of the challenges, and it could be both physical or emotional for you is, is the fear of falling and you're spending some time in terms of self care on that.
Yeah. Talk a little bit about that.
[00:20:47] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm happy to. I knew conceptually that taking care of one's mental health is important. I, I talked about that in your magazine when you interviewed me a while ago.
But for me specifically, the fear of falling is a big issue for me physically because of how my other leg was carved up to try to save the leg that I ultimately lost. But there's a whole mental side to it and you know, it's also tied into the whole getting older thing. So I am doing some cbt, cognitive behavior, behavior therapy to really look at why I have such a big fear of falling. I have a wonderful pt Shirlene Campbell, who works exclusively with amputee. She's amazing. I have a wonderful prosthetist, Karen Bliss. I have a wonderful team.
But I do have some barriers to progressing as an amp. And part of it is accepting what my limitations are, but part of it is challenging myself to confront my fears. And I guess when people confront their fears, it's. It's hard to do it in isolation of your whole personality, your whole life. So when, you know, for example, a therapist wants to talk about traumas in my life, I'm like, well, how long do you have? Because we all have our stories, right? And things that bring us to the point we're at in our life now. Having said that, I think I'm, you know, I've become a more practical person about all these things. My husband was a very practical person. One of the most wonderful, practical people. I was more the ideas person.
I'm trying to be more practical at this stage of my life and focus on the present and the short term and try not to worry about things as much or be as fearful as about things that I may have been in the past. So. So we'll see what happens with this fear of falling.
Amputees do fall. We've. We've read about that in Thrive magazine from experts you've had right. For you. It's. It's not a question of if you're going to fall, it's when. But we want to minimize the risks when we do fall because we need to take care of the rest of our body. And as I said at the beginning, you're so focused on what do I need to do as an amp and what about this amputation? But you really have to look at your whole body, physically and mentally and. And move forward, you know, as best you can.
[00:23:29] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, great answer. Goes back to that Ballistic self care. And that's a component of it, right?
And I think we all, as amputees have different fears when it comes to our residual limbs and.
And maintaining what. What we have as well.
[00:23:47] Speaker B: And I would add, too, I don't. I don't know about you, Jeff, but as an amputee, I think sometimes if there's a sign something else is going on in your body, like, for me, sometimes I think I score higher on the worry scale because it's like I don't Want to have to deal with this new problem in addition to trying to move forward as a fairly new amputee in my 60s. Right. So keeping everything in check, keeping things in perspective, having great medical teams and therapy teams at all, you know, helps because it's. I find my mind can kind of race ahead because dealing with a new issue before amputation was one thing. Dealing with new issues when you're also an amp, I think is a different and bigger challenge.
[00:24:43] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, and so come the verses and the bone spurs and their neuromas and I mean, what an impact on our independence. And these are things we always need to. I anyway, try and keep an eye on and nip them in the bud as, as early as possible because it certainly affects my independence.
[00:25:04] Speaker B: It makes sense. And you know, independence, what you're talking about, that is such a, A key issue for us as amputees and, and maybe redefining what independence is it? You know, I can be a bit all or nothing when it comes to certain things in life, but recognizing that independence comes in different forms and that things take time as you get older as an amputee, maybe not as. Can't do things, not as spontaneously as you used to.
And sometimes you just, you gotta step back if you get a, a blister on a residual limb. Sometimes you, you know, gotta go in the wheelchair. You gotta do something else because the old way of just pushing through can really backfire and have a lot of consequences. So accepting that, you know, you can still be independent, but you might have to do it differently and you might have to slow yourself down a bit because it's. Some of these things will bite you if you don't take care of them.
[00:26:18] Speaker A: That's true.
I mean, you nicely lead into what I wanted to talk to you about next. And that, that's resilience. And I like to ask podcast guest, podcast guests, excuse me, at least one common or similar question, and I think that one will, Will hinge on resilience with, with, with you and I today. What does that mean to you?
[00:26:40] Speaker B: It's a big question. It's a good question. I guess I've always felt resilient, resourceful. And again, you know, one can go back to your childhood and how you were brought up, the circumstances you're raised in. You know, some of mine were challenging for sure, and being the oldest child in my family, the first one to go to school, but also conquering that bout of cancer and as a teenager, sort of automatic resilience required if you want to move forward or you're going to stagnate or just not go forward at all. So some of that, you know, I, I developed, I think, because of the circumstances I was given, you know, when I was younger.
But again, going back to my life with my husband, I think we faced probably an unfair number of challenges over the years. Both of us, if, if there's a fairness score on any of this. But we had, you know, children, you know, which were just. Was amazing thing to raise a young family.
And yes, I got another bout of cancer during that. But we kept, we kept going forward and trying to embrace life as best we could because there was really no other option. We enjoyed, you know, being with family and friends and doing family things. So some of the resilience comes from just, you know, living. And we became, you know, in our, in our jobs, which were very rewarding jobs. You know, we both had strong leadership jobs. You know, I think maybe we put some expectation on ourselves to be good role models. And so the resilience just kind of developed along the way. But I also think sometimes it is luck, sometimes it's being in the right place at the right time and, and capitalizing on opportunities, making connections with people, learning, growing professionally personally and, and helping others. I think both my husband and I have always believed in giving back to our community and our families and our friends. And you know, we've seen, we've seen suffering too, and we've suffered, but I think those things in the end made us stronger and made us keep moving forward and embracing life again. Stephen was very well traveled, very well read. I, I was a very hard worker, a very good problem solver, but he really opened my eyes to the broader world and I think I became a better politician, a better mother, better partner in life, and a more appreciative person.
So I think, I think resilience just comes from all kinds of places and you really, in the end need to focus on, I think, the present and maybe the near term. Nothing wrong with long term goals. That's, that's great too. But I think you have to be willing to adapt and adjust based on your circumstances.
[00:29:59] Speaker A: I like something you said too, and we've talked about resilience before.
You said that you want to have a say in your destiny and that I think that really relates back to resilience as well.
Right?
[00:30:13] Speaker B: For sure, for sure.
Thinking about, you know, what you want to achieve, where you're going, and then, you know, adjusting as you go, which I haven't always been good at because sometimes I just very laser focused on what I want to achieve and often, you know, I've achieved it in my life and that's been great. But sometimes it's just a matter of measuring your success differently and trying to enjoy, you know, the moment and try to find, I wouldn't say happiness all the time, but try to find joy and beauty, you know, on a daily basis in life.
Whether I can get in my pool and swim or have tea with my girlfriends on Friday night.
Taking a lot of joy in that. And I, I find that very motivating and that I think feeds my resilience as well. And, and supporting others, I think that's a big part. Giving back to, to others and supporting others. We all have a different story, we're all different, but everyone can give and receive support for sure.
[00:31:25] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it was nicely packaged. It's a lot of contributors to resilience, both pre amputation and post.
Before we wrap up, and I do want to talk about again a couple of those organizations that you're, you're working with. But yes, before that, advice, advice for others. But let's frame it this way. Your three years as an amputee, that's not long for someone like myself, was coming up to 50 years. But it might seem long for you. But what with what you know now, is there any advice you would give to yourself three years ago when you first became an amputee?
[00:32:08] Speaker B: It's a good question.
I think, you know, the advice to me three years ago would be to not try to fix it so much, to, you know, learn and observe and connect a bit more and that no amount of just pushing forward is going to change the fact I'm an amputee.
And I think the other thing is those early days of being an amputee, I think for myself and perhaps others, you're so fixated on what you need to do. You don't grieve the loss of your limb and you don't recognize what else is going on in your life too. So you have to, you have to look at all that and try to keep going forward. And yes, there's days, as you said, that feel very long and lonely. But you have to again, I think, set some short term goals for, you know, what you want to do and where you want to be and what those goals were three years ago or whenever someone became an amputee, they might need to change. But there's an old Chinese proverb, and I forget how to say it in, in Chinese, but it's something like, with change comes opportunity. So while you may not be doing something, like, for example, I was looking at becoming a justice of the peace, and that was something that people thought I should do, too. But when I really looked at it, I recognized as rewarding as that would be, it would be all consuming. It would trigger my workaholic tendencies, for sure. And I wouldn't have time for maybe my own physical, mental health or my personal. Some of my personal interests.
And so, you know, I stepped back from that goal and I'm working on other things now and was busy, you know, busy with my family, either caregiving or helping plan a wedding, doing some travel.
So letting go of one goal kind of opened up a door, you know, to some other things that I have more time for now than I used to have.
[00:34:29] Speaker A: Yeah. And you've mentioned before, too, that, you know, your amputee experience is. Is your amputee experience. And. And here as we've been chatting, you talked about seeing those ads with, you know, amputees leaping over. Over streams, and it. It sounds like you came to a, you know, conclusion that that might not be everybody. And same with Paralympians who are amputees, that that isn't necessarily representative of the. Most of us.
Would that be something you would have counseled yourself on that, for sure. Not caring, I guess, is what I'm asking.
[00:35:07] Speaker B: Yeah. And not applying maybe the same standards or pressure on myself that I would have in the past. You know, like, I saw something create a goal, and I usually achieved it. I. I think there was certain naivety, too, when I was a new amputee that I thought, well, if I just put the work in, I will.
I'll be like that person on the ad, running over streams and climbing mountains with my prosthetic leg is above knee amputee.
So, you know, injecting a bit more realism and recognizing the station life I'm in. I don't feel old, old. Of course, my mind's still way back, twice or 30s, but respecting the age I am and respecting, you know, what my body's capable of and that may not be capable of and that that's okay, and that we're all getting older. Life is full of inevitable challenges for all of us, whether you're an amputee or not, but not putting that pressure on myself that I may have been applying a bit too much as an early amputee, thinking, I'm gonna. I'm gonna conquer this. Like, I've conquered certain other things in my life. And, you know, my amputation told me otherwise.
[00:36:23] Speaker A: Yes, again, that's right.
You're doing great work with a number of organizations. And what a unique sort of life skill set, expertise, experience that, that you bring to, to these organizations.
No doubt, you know, that being the Amputee Coalition of Canada, Orthotics, Prosthetics Canada, and even the International Society Orthotics Orthotics. So my question is, why so committed so soon? Really? You've. You've jumped in with both feet to use a. Probably a bad pun here, but.
[00:36:58] Speaker B: Right. With one foot.
Yeah.
You know, it just was sort of a natural, natural progression, Jeff. Right. I received peer support as a new amputee. I sought that out and I got interested in what the Amputee Coalition Canada was doing, and I guess they saw something in me and I was quickly recruited to the board of directors. And you know what they say the reward for good work is More work, more work.
And as a national volunteer organization with a great mission, there's just so many opportunities. And that has opened doors, as you said, to partner organizations like OPC and ispo. I don't do quite as much with ispo, more with the OPC in terms of their partnership and advocacy committee.
And I find it very rewarding. And I see problems that need solving, and I've always enjoyed trying to solve problems. Can I solve them all by myself? No. But can I use some of my connections from my previous career to open doors and facilitate discussions? I can do that.
I try to stay at a fairly strategic level, but it's hard not to roll up your sleeves and just dive right in because there's quite a bit of work to do. And I think there's so much education to do. People are shocked to find out how much a prosthetic limb costs. People are shocked to find out how Canadians receive different levels of support for their orthotics or prosthetic care.
So, so much is awareness building and education.
There's a lot of great organizations out there doing good work.
And if through the Amputee Coalition or other bodies, I can help, you know, raise awareness and maybe create some policy or legislative change, you know, I'm very interested in doing that. Having said that, I don't think my future is always going to be about volunteering in the amputee community.
I think, you know, most of us develop a range of skills from our career and life experiences that can be used in different ways. So we'll see what's next. But for now, quite, quite busy trying to raise those issues around access to good orthotic and prosthetic care and trying to change some very outdated policies and programs, not just here in Ontario, but across the country. And I was an Ontario politician, so I'm learning about the rest of the country. So I, yes, did a few things nationally as a politician, but I was an Ontario politician, so there's just so much to absorb and learn about what's going on for other amputees across our country, other demographics, our senior amputees, our indigenous amputees, and remembering that, you know, there's more to life than just Ontario here. As much as I'm a proud Ontarian, there's a much bigger country to look at and change, you know, needs to happen nationally as well as just locally.
[00:40:26] Speaker A: Yeah, I expected your answer to revolve around fixing, you know, to say problems. Yes, but gaps, right? Gaps in education, gaps in funding and something that you've been so good at identifying all your years. And if you think that you're going to walk away when you want to so easily, I don't think any of these organizations are going to let you go as a volunteer that.
That easily, so. But that's a testament to your contribution, so thank you.
[00:40:58] Speaker B: It's true. But the other part of, you know, contributing effectively, as you know, Jeff, is to bring other people into the tent. And I see that as a responsibility, too, whether you're kind of working, working or you're a volunteer, you know, to collaborate and partner with other people, because none of us can fill these gaps by ourselves. So I feel some responsibility to help build something for the future. So do I need to be doing what I'm doing in 10 years around trying to improve access to prosthetic care and funding?
Maybe not. But can I help bring in other people and connect other people so that that journey can continue? Because some of these problems in the amputee world are not going to be fixed maybe as quickly as any of us would like.
[00:41:58] Speaker A: Yeah, they've been around a while, but thanks to folks like you and the rest in the tent right now and others to join you, hopefully those things will get better across the country, as you say. So.
[00:42:13] Speaker B: Well, it's different. It's. You know, it's funny because I think in the United States and I.
I know I belong to some support groups that have a lot of Americans in, which is great.
They have size and scale that we don't have here in Canada. So one of our challenges, we just don't have the per capita population of amps. Not that we want more amps but we don't have that size and scale that they have in the United States. So it's a little different to, for example, get the attention sometimes a government about what the downstream costs are of not providing good prosthetic and orthotic care. What's the downstream cost to people personally and to the taxpayers?
Because we're smallish, maybe compared to some of the other demands on the healthcare system. So everyone needs to be looked after and supported.
But I think there's a lot of misconceptions or myths about what amputees need and what the best solutions are to allow people enjoy quality of life and participate fully in daily living and to mitigate the cost to the system, to the taxpayers.
[00:43:31] Speaker A: Right.
I know you're doing good work with that in meetings with government, with others as well. So, you know, that's probably a long road, but I'm glad it is.
[00:43:43] Speaker B: But, you know, again, what are the milestones?
What are the little moments of progress and success?
As much as I like fixing things, I. My philosophy is progress, not perfection. And keeping our eye, you know, on the prize for, for improvements, recognizing, you know, everybody's, you know, different for sure.
[00:44:05] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, thanks for being that, that voice and that, that advocate, that trooper for us and, and thanks for all you've, you've shared such great insights and you've really welcomed us into your very personal life and, you know, including some of your fears and how you've approached your, your journey and how you're navigating it. Really, really helpful information. So thanks so much, Tracy.
[00:44:27] Speaker B: Well, thank you. And we'll do this again. See where I'm at another three years. See where you're at. Jeff.
[00:44:33] Speaker A: Part two. I love it.
And with that, this has been life and limb. Thank you for listening. You can read about others who are thriving with limb loss or limb difference and plenty more at Thrive Mag. Ca. And you'll find our previous podcast episodes there, too. Until next time, Live well,
